This isn't 1999.

Phrack

Garu wrote:

*CENSORED* and here I was ready to party like it was 1999. " />
Anywho, it's hard to really use "Beyond" as evidence since it's part of Animatrix and not one of the shorts written by the Wachowskis. Though it was inspired like the others, they do contain things that contradict the "canon" of the Matrix universe, as envisioned by the Wachowskis.
I may be wrong but who cares what year it is in the Matrix anyway?

You have a point.

My point is that as a writer, why limit yourself in any aspect? By making it a never-ending 1999, you're limiting technological progress and so many other things. On top of that, you're limiting it to a community that is always craving something new.

I might also add that "never-ending 1999" was a concept that was never introduced until MxO.

**Archangel**

PS10N wrote:

BAD Ideas that are NOT in the movies but have stunk their way in to MxO canon:

1) It's always 1999 in the Matrix.
2) The Matrix is only a big city and a surrounding mountain range.
3) Morpheus found five "failed Ones" before finding Neo.

And before I get jumped (again) for #3 because "it's in the original script:" it was in the script and was not shot in to the movie because it was a BAD IDEA that they REJECTED. Going thru old movie scripts to find things that were not used in order to show that they were "real" is pretty flawed. The early scripts of "Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan" don't include Spock's death so, following the same logic as those who are whining "but it's in the script they didn't use!" then Spock didn't die in Wrath of Khan, either, even tho that's what everyone saw on the screen. The W Bros re-used the concept of "five previous Ones" in Reloaded, so throwing it back on top of the present cycle makes no sense and is the equivalent of eating thrown away food out of garbage bin. They threw it out because it was bad - why are you so eager to eat it up?

Seriously, PS10N, why is it so hard for you to conceive of the plausability that Morpheus, in his zealousness to fulfill his destiny, jumped to the conclusion that he had found "The One" when all he had really found was another average Joe. It's not that far out of a concept. But anyways, while we're on the continuity train...something that's always bugged me...

Why is it Mega City when this states otherwise:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo_%28The_Matrix%29

**Aquilae** · 12/12/2007 13:56:38

MxO-PhanthomZtryker wrote:

Vesuveus wrote:
2007 in The Matrix, closer to 2207 in the Real.

Don't you mean 3007?
I think he said 1999 was 2999.

2199

Edit: Didn't see the second (or third page).

**10011**

In regard to the 1999 thing, I have always felt this way and continue to feel this way:

The numerical progression of time is unaltered and keeps ticking away like it's supposed to.
However, the society/technology/atmosphere never progresses beyond the status quo of 1999. There are no big changes in their world, every day is just like any other, and everyone accepts it. I think that fits in with the theme of the movie about accepting the status quo vs. challenging authority.

I always assumed the Matrix was more about conditioning the bluepills to accept that nothing ever changes, rather than altering the details of their reality to explain why nothing ever changes.

**Xeros**

Er, I thought of this before my break actually, along with a few other inconsistencies. Amongst these are the fact that since comics are considered canon in the eyes of the creators, other areas DO exist in the Matrix (possibly different Matrixes or sectioned areas), including Mexico. 'Mega City' is also most appropriately Capital City. Since I can't recall hearing that it was always 1999, I looked into it to see where we are now and deducted the year 2003, however I just went back and made two outlines based on what we know thus far:

Reloaded/Revolutions takes place nearly exactly six months after The Matrix, and the events thereafter took place in real time. I count beta, because while it didn't have an active storyline, it can symbolize the time Zion took to rebuild and to gain a population base in the Matrix post-war.

9/18/99 - Neo phone call to Machines
03/2000 - 6 months, reloaded / revolutions
06/2001 - june 2004, beta begins
03/2002 - march 2005, mxo released
12/2004 - Now

With recylce:

9/18/99 - Neo Phone call to Machines
03/2000 - 6 Months, Reloaded/Revolutions
01/01/1999 - System reset after Smith
02/2000 - june 2004, beta begins
11/2000 - march 2005, mxo released
01/2003 - Now

**Kemy**

Including this and all, I mean ALL the other things that happened in MXO, after the movies... It's just that, to me, the movies kinda gave the idea that 'the watchers/audience/you and me' were bluepills and that our world, planet earth, was the Matrix. And since I've been playing MXO, the more this idea drifts away.
Yet this is what was so interesting about it.
All respect to the writes of the story, I guess this is what the Matrix is. But for me it's pretty far away from the image that the movies left behind. Yet the Animatrix carried this image too, I saw it, there were small holes that contradict a thing here and there, but I can look passed that easily. Big things, like it's always '99, one city, no planet, the hacker trees, the flashy effects, big fly monsters, simulacra's...all things that, if you ask me, weren't needed for the Matrix to make it more interesting. It were the small things, like using a phone to log out of the world, dejavu's that aren't real, the use of numbers here and there that had to do with computers (0, 1, 8, 16, 101, 303), comparing real life with how a computer works, that kinda stuff is what got me fascinated about the Matrix.
Oh well, I'll accept it and meh, it's just the way it is. Could've been better but I'm enjoying how it is anyway.

**ZippyTheSquirrel**

It's whatever year Rarebit says it is.

**GamiSB** · 12/12/2007 12:53:46

Its simple, Beyond isn't canon. This only shows that nothing that the W Bros or Paul C did not direct or write should be taken as canon.

The other five films and comics are just published fan fiction that the W bros enjoyed and decided to share with everyone along with their own ideas.

The Matrix time line simple goes like this

02/19/95 - Trinity's call
9/18/96 - Neo Phone call to Machines
03/97 - Reloaded/Revolutions starts and ends 3 days later
05/97 - MxO Story line starts up
06/12/99 - The war starts again

**GamiSB**

Archangel wrote:

PS10N wrote:
BAD Ideas that are NOT in the movies but have stunk their way in to MxO canon:

1) It's always 1999 in the Matrix.
2) The Matrix is only a big city and a surrounding mountain range.
3) Morpheus found five "failed Ones" before finding Neo.

And before I get jumped (again) for #3 because "it's in the original script:" it was in the script and was not shot in to the movie because it was a BAD IDEA that they REJECTED. Going thru old movie scripts to find things that were not used in order to show that they were "real" is pretty flawed. The early scripts of "Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan" don't include Spock's death so, following the same logic as those who are whining "but it's in the script they didn't use!" then Spock didn't die in Wrath of Khan, either, even tho that's what everyone saw on the screen. The W Bros re-used the concept of "five previous Ones" in Reloaded, so throwing it back on top of the present cycle makes no sense and is the equivalent of eating thrown away food out of garbage bin. They threw it out because it was bad - why are you so eager to eat it up?

Seriously, PS10N, why is it so hard for you to conceive of the plausability that Morpheus, in his zealousness to fulfill his destiny, jumped to the conclusion that he had found "The One" when all he had really found was another average Joe. It's not that far out of a concept. But anyways, while we're on the continuity train...something that's always bugged me...
Why is it Mega City when this states otherwise:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo_%28The_Matrix%29

It should be noted that five is not an offical number. It only says that he found others that wern't the real deal meaning at least 2. Five is just the number stuck to it because of the "Five before Neo" thing the Architect explains.

**Lezel**

Reeverb wrote:

Including this and all, I mean ALL the other things that happened in MXO, after the movies... It's just that, to me, the movies kinda gave the idea that 'the watchers/audience/you and me' were bluepills and that our world, planet earth, was the Matrix. And since I've been playing MXO, the more this idea drifts away.
Yet this is what was so interesting about it.
All respect to the writes of the story, I guess this is what the Matrix is. But for me it's pretty far away from the image that the movies left behind. Yet the Animatrix carried this image too, I saw it, there were small holes that contradict a thing here and there, but I can look passed that easily. Big things, like it's always '99, one city, no planet, the hacker trees, the flashy effects, big fly monsters, simulacra's...all things that, if you ask me, weren't needed for the Matrix to make it more interesting. It were the small things, like using a phone to log out of the world, dejavu's that aren't real, the use of numbers here and there that had to do with computers (0, 1, 8, 16, 101, 303), comparing real life with how a computer works, that kinda stuff is what got me fascinated about the Matrix.
Oh well, I'll accept it and meh, it's just the way it is. Could've been better but I'm enjoying how it is anyway.

You put this in a good way I think Reeverb..I agree with you 200%..

I agree with the whole story ,but i highlighted these paticular comments for a reason...because both of them are quite true..and I believe that more can be done for the greater future of this game and to uphold the nature of the films..

However, I do also believe Rarebit is not God, but he's trying to an extent..and for that I respect him..

**Croesis**

Remember that as redpills we are aware more of the code and what is actually going on around us. So the hacking graphics are just us enhancing what is actually happening. What bluepills may be able to explain away as imagination could be things we take for granted.

In the end... it is a game and certain aspects of it (such as the EJP) are there for the benefit of us gamers. Its the compromise of story vs game mechanics take out all of the glowing graphics and the hacker graphics and it will be less visually appealing but you can toggle them off if you don't like them. This explains why the 'one city' has crept into the story. They have a lot longer to explore certain things in a continuous online game then a trilogy of films concerned with a couple of intertwined storylines with multiple layers of meaning and also the game is limited to that city. There is only so far one vehicle of story telling can stick with another before compromising has to start happening.

**Lezel**

Vinia wrote:

Remember that as redpills we are aware more of the code and what is actually going on around us. So the hacking graphics are just us enhancing what is actually happening. What bluepills may be able to explain away as imagination could be things we take for granted.

In the end... it is a game and certain aspects of it (such as the EJP) are there for the benefit of us gamers. Its the compromise of story vs game mechanics take out all of the glowing graphics and the hacker graphics and it will be less visually appealing but you can toggle them off if you don't like them. This explains why the 'one city' has crept into the story. They have a lot longer to explore certain things in a continuous online game then a trilogy of films concerned with a couple of intertwined storylines with multiple layers of meaning and also the game is limited to that city. There is only so far one vehicle of story telling can stick with another before compromising has to start happening.

I see you're point of view as well.. SMILEY

\m/><\m/

**Kemy**

Vinia wrote:

Remember that as redpills we are aware more of the code and what is actually going on around us. So the hacking graphics are just us enhancing what is actually happening. What bluepills may be able to explain away as imagination could be things we take for granted.

In the end... it is a game and certain aspects of it (such as the EJP) are there for the benefit of us gamers. Its the compromise of story vs game mechanics take out all of the glowing graphics and the hacker graphics and it will be less visually appealing but you can toggle them off if you don't like them. This explains why the 'one city' has crept into the story. They have a lot longer to explore certain things in a continuous online game then a trilogy of films concerned with a couple of intertwined storylines with multiple layers of meaning and also the game is limited to that city. There is only so far one vehicle of story telling can stick with another before compromising has to start happening.

Aye, I know why there are flashy effects such as pretty much the whole hacker tree. What I would've liked, and actually expected to see instead before I started on MXO was the same class set up that any MMO has, but every offensive hacker tree were would be with grenades (AOE dmg) and rocket launchers (Ballista), and I think you can fill the rest in yourself from here. Perhaps the budget was too small to make explosion animations, or make more guns, more items, and the flashy stuff was cheaper, or easier to implement. I understand that, I respect it, but it's not what I expected to see in the Matrix as a redpill.

It is a game, EJP is needed, I won't say anything about EJP. Same with the city. Of course we can't explore planet earth but it wasn't needed to tell the players there actually was only one city. Just say OOC: We're game devs, we have a limited budget and this city is all we can build at the time.
Anyway, when I think back of how I thought MXO would be as an MMO, I thought of the movies. I thought of realism and how to bend realism. I never thought that in MXO, I would see things of which there are no equavelent in real life (fly monster, hacker trees, etc.). That goes with everything that has happened in MXO the past few years. There weren't many things that got me to say: Oh, so that's how I see it from a redpill perspective, while as a bluepill (as a player, in real life) I see it like this. I see a red grid popping up as a redpill, knowing someone's hacking but without the red grid, the waving in the air looks quite dumb and dumb has nothing to do with the smooth and cool moves that the movies had.

Anyhow, it's here. It's always 1999, apperently. It makes sense for the game mechanics, I have to admit that, because it'd be freaking hard to give more content to bluepills, like bluetooth phones and plasma tv's. =P But this is not the Matrix I imagined it would be, and together with the year '99 and all the other unrealistic implements, I certainly find it a tad disappointing.

**Gerik**

Was just doing the new Merv archives and found that.

**MatrixRefugee**

"Always 1999" doesn't really faze me in the least. It puts me in mind of another "What is real?" movie of 1999, Alex Proyas's "Dark City", which features a mysterious city where it's always nighttime, and it always appears to be some time vaguely in the 1940s or early 1950s. The reason for this: the beings in charge of the city bring everything to a standstill every night, send all the inhabitants into a coma-like sleep via mind-control, then rearrange the scenery ...and the inhabitants ... and the inhabitants memories. The film was in production about the time the first Matrix movie was and is sometimes mistakenly considered one of the inspirations for it, but it *does* bear more than a passing resemblence (most of it was probably unintentional, but unavoidable: the same Sydney, Australia rooftops were used for a chase scene in both movies, and the kid who played Spoon Boy in the first Matrix movie also has a bit part). And I swear the Strangers of "Dark City" could be some sort of prototype Agents in Industrial Fedoras and black Boucher coats.