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Sneak test
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Systemic Anomaly

Joined: Aug 16, 2005
Messages: 3113
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Managed a bit of testing of the sneak ability last night with the kind assist of CLAUIDUS and BrightMorning and a small selection of NPC's at Industry square.
 
Against NPC's sadly it remains very very ineffective, in ten approches only 2 did I get within attack range before my 'Sneak' broke. In fact it is very clear the NPC's knew of my approach in most cases as easily as if I had just walked toward them (indeed they would be shooting me even though the sneak 'held'). Once spotted by an NPC you need to retreat to a significant distance to remove their uncanny ability to see you and even predict where you are going to emerge. Even weaving between level 41 NPC's regularly caused my sneak to break, I'm afraid real tests on the spy tree against npc's will not be possible till this is sorted.
 
Against players things seem very different and a more encouraging, on most occasions I was able to get into an attack position with the player unaware, sadly the success rate of landing assassin attacks isn't high (but maybe that is down to my stats and clothes), worse for a failed strike the punishment was harsh with between a third and half my HP had gone and no evident damage to my foe as I manically do a sideways rollout. The biggest issue is re-cloaking for a follow up attack, the players awareness coupled with the presence of npc's (only level 1) meant finding a spot to drop back into sneak was very challenging, a smart ma would be on you or would leap away to really impact on any chance of a kill and in a group of players I would imagine (as I can't test it) one shot will be all that is possible. Perhaps after a sucessful strike a stealthing bonus could facilitate an eaier route to engage sneak or disguise etc.
 
My initial build was MA/assasin subjectively that seemed poor despite the solider tree housing both neither branch seems to complement the other and both feel ineffective therefore - Moving to assasin+Mkt was much more sucessful....this is a disturbing potential consequence of CR2 that hybrid builds have far less flexibilty given that abilities have been replaced by buffs and those buffs dont stack. Basically you decide to use either ma OR assassin and practically speaking until you are able to step away from the battle changing seems unwise. Perfect for duels less so for the manic wars usually experienced on Vector.
 
I finished the seesion with a very tidy assassination combining knives and assassin strikes which left me encouraged that the main issues could be solved through balancing.
 
Hopefully will be able to experiment a little further tonight but with disguise and 'disable evasion' were not available to test, after sneak I suspect these will be the next critical abilities to make or break the tree.



Transcendent

Joined: Aug 21, 2005
Messages: 165
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Thank you for your work on assassin testing Tytanya.  The other assassins are very greatful.  Lemme know if you ever need any help.

-Endonesia
Hit'cha till ya seizure





Joined: Aug 16, 2005
Messages: 282
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disable evasion works, but it's not effective at all. just use your weakness analizer tool and you will disable the evade shield... for like 2 seconds.
It will break your sneak, so you'll have to: reatreat, put your sneak back on, get closer and execute your move. All in a couple of seconds. no. it's not playable at all right now.


Transcendent

Joined: Aug 21, 2005
Messages: 165
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I completly agree.  I went there and tried it myself.   I was lvl 50 fully leveled master assassin.   I goto a fresh batch of lvl 15 NPC's .   Came up to them in sneak from atleast 50 meters.   I select my target and try to sneak up from their back side.    Once I get within about 10 meters even though they are totally passive towards me they alwys turn and look right at me.   Then as I try to turn around to their back side then continue to pivot so they're looking right at me.   Then finally they blow my sneak cover.   This happens to me about 9 of every 10 tries.  

It is completly useless right now.



Systemic Anomaly

Joined: Aug 16, 2005
Messages: 3113
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Yes more testing today and the encouragement I felt yesterday has gone. Running around Mara you are clearly visible to players most of the time; didnt manage to execute a single assassin strike before being seen SMILEY. Even more humiliating one of the few times i was able to get close enough to an npc (a level 15!) he managed to repel my reverse bulldog attempt!! With all spy appropriate buffs levelled and maxed that was just unbelieveable. I feel there is nothing more to be gained by any more testing until sneak is sorted SMILEY 



Transcendent

Joined: Aug 21, 2005
Messages: 165
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*begs*

God of all creation (Chuck Norris)
Please save us all
and please save assassin.




Vindicator

Joined: Aug 15, 2005
Messages: 5445
Location: In Exilium
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Originally, I had been running around without sneak fully leveled - it goes to 50 now.
I was hoping that that was the source of my problems.
... It wasn't.

Sneak definitely needs some serious tweaking.
... On the plus side, it's mainly a number-balancing issue at this point, which means that the system itself has the capacity to function properly.

- Void



Ascendent Logic

Joined: Oct 29, 2005
Messages: 822
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ya, i'm new to the mkt tree, and on the ep i was running full mkt and as far as i could go on assassin (which may be useless since the buffs don't stack?)

 

Apparently i was fully visible to all players in the area, and my knife attacks were only doing about 200 damage which seems low due to the length of cast on some.  i used an rsi hack to try putting as many pts as possible into the two categories that helped ranged/balistic attacks, as well as using all the clothes i could find to help with sneak duration and ranged etc and it still didn't help much.  I haven't tried against npcs, but in the pvp world (ie my vector world) it is pretty useless.  very much a bummer, i like the tree!




Code Breaker

Joined: Jan 9, 2006
Messages: 1320
Location: The Source Faction: My Own Organization: None
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As I have stated in another thread the sneak detection system is getting looked at.



Ascendent Logic

Joined: Oct 29, 2005
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ok ty!  SMILEY



Ascendent Logic

Joined: Aug 15, 2005
Messages: 851
Location: The Shadows of Vector
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NoRepro wrote:
As I have stated in another thread the sneak detection system is getting looked at.


Respectfully, you do realize that this makes the entire spy tree broken beyond all testing?

There should be no higher priority in my opinion.




Femme Fatale

Joined: Aug 15, 2005
Messages: 11028
Location: Las Vegas, NV
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Spadz wrote:


NoRepro wrote:
As I have stated in another thread the sneak detection system is getting looked at.


Respectfully, you do realize that this makes the entire spy tree broken beyond all testing?

There should be no higher priority in my opinion.



Cept damage. But yeah I use Assassin a lot and I was utterly shocked (SHOCKED I SAY!) when I tried this build out.





Joined: Aug 16, 2005
Messages: 282
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spy can potentially do A LOT more damage! The problem is that the ability analize weakness is not working correctly. A W gives you +65  pts of thrown dmg! unfortunately there is a 50 pts cap... and considering that spy style grants you +46 pts thrown dmg, spies are not as powerful as the devs meant them to be.
 
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