When Smith Becomes Oracle

**Raviola**

I haven't watched my trilogy recently because of work/study, but over xmas I'm going to watch each movie again.

But I think I'm right about this: In Revolutions Smith tells Oracle You should know Mom when she says he's a bastard. Then he pierces her with his hand after she says Do what you're here to do and he says Yes, ma'am.

My question is: Anybody know what Oracle, after turning into a copy of Smith, starts cackling her head off about? I never really figured that out; is it b/c she saw he's gonna lose to Neo in the big fight? Well, if so, didn't she know that way before he copied onto her, so why would that be worth laughing her behind off over? Is she just overcome with hysteria after her son (apparently) copied himself over her?

Anyway, someone give me their opinion. That's actually been nagging me for a while. Thanks!

**GamiSB**

My take from it was he started laughing cuse he was seeing the end and his victory over Neo. But as the Oracle said no one can see past the choices they don't understand so he could not see what the result of Neo's sacrifice would be.

Chemuel

GamiSB wrote:

My take from it was he started laughing cuse he was seeing the end and his victory over Neo. But as the Oracle said no one can see past the choices they don't understand so he could not see what the result of Neo's sacrifice would be.

Yup. He can see Neo's death at his hands.

**Othinn1**

This is somewhat off topic, and I'll have to study the scene some more to be sure ... Is it my imagination, or does the vase fall again during the code vision part of Smith's takeover of the Oracle? When I look at the right side of the screen during that scene, I see something that looks like the vase falling.

**GamiSB**

It probably does. There's alot of energy going off in that room during that part (cabinets flying open etc) so I think its safe to assume that yeah the vase does get knocked off again. If that was intended or not to have some kinda meaning I haven't the faintest idea but knowing the W bros I'd say yes.

**GypsyJuggler**

Without reviewing the scene, I have the feeling it was a cackle of success at having dominated every RSI in the System.

**ManicV**

Othinn1 wrote:

This is somewhat off topic, and I'll have to study the scene some more to be sure ... Is it my imagination, or does the vase fall again during the code vision part of Smith's takeover of the Oracle? When I look at the right side of the screen during that scene, I see something that looks like the vase falling.

I wouldn't be surprised. There are a couple wink/nods to the first movie peppered throughout Reloaded and Revolutions. When Smith tries to copy onto Neo before the big fight in Debir Court, as Neo counteracts the copying process, you can faintly hear the scream that Smith let out in the final scene from The Matrix before Neo destroyed him.

But back on topic, I agree with Gami. It wasn't necessarily The Oracle laughing through Smith, but rather it was Smith himself laughing after gaining the knowledge of what was going to happen. He saw that he was going to win the fight against Neo, but he couldn't see past his choice to defeat Neo. He didn't understand that he and Neo were two sides of the same equation, so he didn't understand that Neo's death would mean his own death.

Of course the important thing is, as the Oracle might say, to make up your own d**** mind. SMILEY

**Scolirk**

When smith copied himself over the various programs, wouldn't that give him access to the program itself? Technically he would have seen the oracle's visions, and saw him defeating Neo. He mentions in the final scene, "This is just how I saw it. I stood.. here, and I say...", which probably had something to do with the Oracle program.

**Fractor**

Scolirk wrote:

When smith copied himself over the various programs, wouldn't that give him access to the program itself? Technically he would have seen the oracle's visions, and saw him defeating Neo. He mentions in the final scene, "This is just how I saw it. I stood.. here, and I say...", which probably had something to do with the Oracle program.

He then says "everything that has a beginning has an end" which is a quote from the Oracle so yes I think the Oracle program gave him insight that if Neo died he will die too. This is why he was suddenly reluctant to finish him off and then foolishly copied himself on him which gave Deus Ex Machina a link to send a virus through Neo's RSI to destroy the Smith program.

**GypsyJuggler**

Fractor wrote:

Scolirk wrote:
When smith copied himself over the various programs, wouldn't that give him access to the program itself? Technically he would have seen the oracle's visions, and saw him defeating Neo. He mentions in the final scene, "This is just how I saw it. I stood.. here, and I say...", which probably had something to do with the Oracle program.
He then says "everything that has a beginning has an end" which is a quote from the Oracle so yes I think the Oracle program gave him insight that if Neo died he will die too. This is why he was suddenly reluctant to finish him off and then foolishly copied himself on him which gave Deus Ex Machina a link to send a virus through Neo's RSI to destroy the Smith program.

I rather think that when he said "...everything that has a beginning has an end." the Oracle was to speaking through him rather than him speaking with Oracular insight. And the destruction of Smith seemed to be Neo using the same trick from the end of the first movie rather than any action of Dues Ex Machina.

**GamiSB** · 12/12/2007 21:56:41

GypsyJuggler wrote:

Fractor wrote:
Scolirk wrote:
When smith copied himself over the various programs, wouldn't that give him access to the program itself? Technically he would have seen the oracle's visions, and saw him defeating Neo. He mentions in the final scene, "This is just how I saw it. I stood.. here, and I say...", which probably had something to do with the Oracle program.
He then says "everything that has a beginning has an end" which is a quote from the Oracle so yes I think the Oracle program gave him insight that if Neo died he will die too. This is why he was suddenly reluctant to finish him off and then foolishly copied himself on him which gave Deus Ex Machina a link to send a virus through Neo's RSI to destroy the Smith program.
I rather think that when he said "...everything that has a beginning has an end." the Oracle was to speaking through him rather than him speaking with Oracular insight. And the destruction of Smith seemed to be Neo using the same trick from the end of the first movie rather than any action of Dues Ex Machina.

The quote is something from the Oracles programing comeing through him. Smith had seen everything up to that point and knew he was nearing the end of his fight. But he didn't understand what was happening which scared him. He saw Neo lying on the ground beaten and knew what he had to say but after that it was all new. He didn't understand Neo's choice or his own after that point and haveing been dependent on forsight, fate, and the system to tell him what to do and now he was scared . Smith for the first time had to choose what to do.

You know you kinda have to feel sorry for him at the end.

**PS10N** · 12/07/2007 11:06:44

"which gave Deus Ex Machina a link to send a virus through Neo's RSI to destroy the Smith program."

That's not what happened. This is the biggest lie ever told about the plot of The Matrix movies; it originated from someone who didn't understand anything they had just seen and who needed to invent a "neato sci-fi" reason to fit their limited cogniscence. Because it was repeated over and over and over ad infinitum ad nausea, it has been believed by the majority who simply don't know any better. (Thus, this isn't a shot at the post's author; he's merely read in to the nonsense.) All the answers to every question brought up in a Matrix medium are answered somewhere else in the story. I for one am sick to death of repeating what is already there to hear in the scripts. "Open to interpretation" and blah blah blah but don't make up crap that isn't in the movies, that goes against what is in the movies and expect anyone who was paying attention to accept it.

EDIT: more on topic and less pissy, yes, Smith gained the knowledge of his hosts. ("What did you do with Sati?" | "Cookies need love like everything does.") The very same Smith who said that line was the Smith who had been Sati before her shell was overwritten. Thusly, Smith gains "the Sight" by taking over Oracle ("You have the Sight now Neo, you are seeing the world without time" / "They say [the eyes of the Oracle] cannot be taken, they can only be given.") and could see up to the point of his understanding of his choices: defeating Neo. Neo had no such foresight about his own choice. He had to understand that choosing to fight simply made both sides stronger and the whole more unbalanced. This "Satori of Sati" if you will (and if you can,) resulted in polar opposites being brought directly together, balancing the equation in one violent connection which by definition destroyed both imbalances.

"And the destruction of Smith seemed to be Neo using the same trick from the end of the first movie rather than any action of Dues Ex Machina."

Props to you for this, GypsyJuggler. The W. Brothers always wanted to make The Matrix a trilogy, but if that didn't happen, they wanted to use the ideas from the trilogy in the original, but without giving them all away in case there would be a trilogy. (Isn't movie making interesting?) So, you will see little hints of Reloaded and Revolutions in the original if you look closely. The old bum in the subway station who sees Morpheus jack-out was a "plot shadow" of the Trainman. There are others, but I'll leave them to the watchers.

**Croesis**

From what I understood through all of the layers of story was that Smith took over Neo, fulfilling his only purpose, and unbalancing the equation. I've always taken that in doing so Smith is directly connected to the machine mainframe through Neo's body as he was jacked in through the Machines which enabled them to directly access the Smith program and destroy it. I've heard of other theories, that when Smith overwrote him that allowed Neo to do what he did at the end of the first and destroy Smith from the inside... but there are a couple of things that this makes me wonder about...

If Neo is the exact opposite of Smith and Smith beat him to exhaustion how would Neo have the mental energy to do it again and to all of the Smiths everywhere? Also, what does Deus Ex Machina do to Neo's body after Smith overwrites him?

**BandaAncha**

Vinia wrote:

Also, what does Deus Ex Machina do to Neo's body after Smith overwrites him?

thats the mistery that drives the game

**Croesis**

BandaAncha wrote:

Vinia wrote:
Also, what does Deus Ex Machina do to Neo's body after Smith overwrites him?
thats the mistery that drives the game

I meant the pulse that shocks Neo's body when it's been overwritten.... is it meant to resuscitate Neo's mind inside Smith. You can see why it's easy for people to speculate that the Deus Ex Machina could use the connection with Neos body to destroy Smith as its a direct connection....